Let's stir things up a bit.

Hahaha... "it is too late to vote for the white guy"

lol. wow.

fox news told me obama is a terrorist

Obama - One Big Ass Mistake America.




Logan needs to quit watching CNN and MSNBC.

I get my news from that daily show thank you very much.

Overboosting wrote:

I get my news from that daily show thank you very much.

Try the Onion. Or NBC 15, Leigh Mills is hot

^ Yes she is. She's pretty damn short though.

Tusk wrote:

^ Yes she is. She's pretty damn short though.

thats even better

Tusk wrote:

^ Yes she is. She's pretty damn short though.

She's got some tig ol bitties for her size too!

Personally I'm a Carleen Wild fan! Now she is smoking!

Mike

BWHAHAHAHA. "What have we done?"

Well, you took the Presidency as a American Idol instead of wondering what the candidates would actually do....

Txt 12345 and vote for #4 now

lilwillie wrote:

BWHAHAHAHA. "What have we done?"

Well, you took the Presidency as a American Idol instead of wondering what the candidates would actually do....

Exactly!

When did the President get the power to make laws? I guess I must have missed it.

overblown wrote:

When did the President get the power to make laws? I guess I must have missed it.

1789, "Executive orders"

ok so how about an answer based in reality.

overblown wrote:

ok so how about an answer based in reality.

That is my reality based answer. Presidents for years have set the tone with Executive orders. It is the fastest way for them to put policy into action. If you want to get into the details, no, they technically aren't laws. For the last few Presidents the Executive branch is expanding its powers.

If you want the cheap and easy answer that just adds fuel to the fire how does a health care law get called "Obamacare"?

I do want to get into details because they are not laws which is my point seeing as how thats the question I actually asked. People act as if the President has the powers of a King. As if he can come into office and wave his wand, watching his subjects do his every bidding and carry out his will uncontested. I will never get over how little people know about how our government works and then insist on having an opinion that they feel should be taken seriously. That is not directed at you so don't take offense.

I am referring to the countless people I hear babble on about how much each of our Presidents is awful at their jobs, they were a mistake, and they didn't do this or do that so they suck. I would put money on the statement that most of those kind of people only know the Presidents name. I bet they have no idea who represents them on a state or district level, something so basic. I'd bet they also have no idea what it takes to actually get things done in this bloated and fiercely divided government of ours.

I get that Presidents are the face of our nation but they are not Dictators. Just because a President wants to do something, and tells you about it, doesn't mean its going to get done. Because its not just up to him. It has been like that from the start yet people refuse to see it for whatever reason.

As for obamacare, its pretty simple and I'd think self explanatory but I'll go ahead and say it anyway. It is a bill brought forth under and the Obama Administration. What I find amusing about it is that it wasn't even Obama's idea yet it got his name anyway. Its a conservative derived mandate. Sooooo......

overblown wrote:

I get that Presidents are the face of our nation but they are not Dictators. Just because a President wants to do something, and tells you about it, doesn't mean its going to get done. Because its not just up to him. It has been like that from the start yet people refuse to see it for whatever reason.

Hence my laughing because many in this country did vote for Obama because they thought he would get everything he promised done.

Quote :

As for obamacare, its pretty simple and I'd think self explanatory but I'll go ahead and say it anyway. It is a bill brought forth under and the Obama Administration. What I find amusing about it is that it wasn't even Obama's idea yet it got his name anyway. Its a conservative derived mandate. Sooooo......

Source on that, I've never heard someone argue it was a conservative derived mandate. Are you refering to the name of the bill in the media or are you referring that the bill was a conservative idea in the first place. I'll still call it his bill because when the left had complete control of the House and Senate BHO pushed hard, pushing his agenda and what he would want in it. He also cleary stated (to late in the day, I'm beat to find the link) that this bill was going through and the Repubs had to live with that. Not sure if that is the exact wording but you understand my point.

I understand what you are getting at and agree that people do have a unclear view what to expect of a President. For me personally, I didn't have any expectations for this one. I knew he was riding in on the wave of anti-right hate from 8 years of Bush. Most of that hate screamed Bush was ruining the world. Now the right will scream BHO is ruining it. I'm old enough to have seen this before

and so it begins.....

mike

Ever heard of the terms "State of Emergency" and "Martial Law"? The President can in certain circumstances ( due to the patriot act and other laws over the years ) declare a state of emergency, suspend certain rights and privileges and declare martial law. There is a VERY large Grey area as to what constitutes a "State of Emergency", so in all reality if our president wanted to attempt to take total control using the Military, HE COULD.

I'm saying ATTEMPT, because most red blooded Americans would not stand for it. We would have to have widespread destruction or an active invasion on our soil to constitute that IMHO. And really, there's not a damn thing that congress could do about it.


Is it right? In certain circumstances..... yes. In anything that we can currently foresee, absolutely not. It all depends on the crisis. IT also depends on a LOT of different factors that have to many variables to predict. This is one of the reasons why I own guns, have non perishable food stored away, and have a plan to take care of my Family when shit hits the fan. If you think you can count on the government in a major crisis, think again.

Regardless, the point is that if he wants to, the President can pretty much do whatever the hell he wants.

lilwillie wrote:

overblown wrote:

I get that Presidents are the face of our nation but they are not Dictators. Just because a President wants to do something, and tells you about it, doesn't mean its going to get done. Because its not just up to him. It has been like that from the start yet people refuse to see it for whatever reason.

1. Hence my laughing because many in this country did vote for Obama because they thought he would get everything he promised done.

Quote :

As for obamacare, its pretty simple and I'd think self explanatory but I'll go ahead and say it anyway. It is a bill brought forth under and the Obama Administration. What I find amusing about it is that it wasn't even Obama's idea yet it got his name anyway. Its a conservative derived mandate. Sooooo......

2. Source on that, I've never heard someone argue it was a conservative derived mandate. Are you refering to the name of the bill in the media or are you referring that the bill was a conservative idea in the first place. I'll still call it his bill because when the left had complete control of the House and Senate BHO pushed hard, pushing his agenda and what he would want in it. He also cleary stated (to late in the day, I'm beat to find the link) that this bill was going through and the Repubs had to live with that. Not sure if that is the exact wording but you understand my point.

I understand what you are getting at and agree that people do have a unclear view what to expect of a President. For me personally, I didn't have any expectations for this one. I knew he was riding in on the wave of anti-right hate from 8 years of Bush. Most of that hate screamed Bush was ruining the world. Now the right will scream BHO is ruining it. I'm old enough to have seen this before

1. Agreed. Their complaint should be with their own ignorance.

2. It's actually pretty interesting and more than a little amusing. The idea of mandated health care, really got rolling when one of the most conservative "think tanks" out there called Heritage Group released the proposal for mandated healthcare in the 90's. While looking for links to show you, I happened to also find out that Bob Dole who was the senate majority leader even co-sponsored the bill. This idea has popped its head up in one form or another several times since then but always based around this original proposal. This is a direct quote from that proposal which funny enough is still on their website. "In return, government would require, by law every head of household to acquire at least a basic health plan for his or her family.Thus there would be mandated coverage under the Heritage proposal, but the mandate w ould apply to the family head, who is the appropriate person to shoulder the primary responsibility for the familys health needs, rather than employers, who are not EFFECTS OF THE HERlTAGE.PROPOSAL".

What makes this really funny is that if you go onto their website right now, they have an entire section dedicated to bashing Obamacare and saying how bad it is for the country. Many of the same ideas they proposed in order to, and I quote "the Heritage proposal significantly would improve the American health system." are also found in Obamacare. So despite sharing many of the same views on this and working across party lines to accomplish something good, they have chosen to attack the plan altogether since it is now so closely aligned with Obama and the democratic party. Its like watching kids on the playground. Sometimes, I wish we did have a King.



Edit: Blackout, no. You should sit this one out buddy.

I could go link digging but this is a civil conversation so there is no need to throw links at each other. I will dig this one up as a refresher for those that don't remember the early 90's. http://www.princeton.edu/~starr/20starr.html

I remember in the 90's the Right touting a health care system but it was to allow more private health care and not as much government control by opening up the borders so you could purchase it across state lines. With one big focus being on Tort Reform. It was also a counter to Hillary's health care plan which was shot down pretty fast by a Republican congress.

The amount of vouchers for businesses friendly to the left. Being told that we need to pass the bill to find out what is in it, how it will affect things, is fundamentally wrong to me. Give me less Government. I've sat through some seminars for business and how Obamacare will affect things. It won't be pretty when this hits. You will see business passing the added costs down the line to lower wages or higher prices to customers.

The feds continually think asking the private sector to pay more for more government is a good thing. If I can find a way, with my accountant, to not pay in at the end of the year. I'll do it.

You talked early about the the divided sides in government. That is the least of our worries. The country is more divided than ever. It isn't left vs. right. It is now haves and have-nots. Yes, I am changing the subject but keeping it on our current Prez.

If he really thinks attacking "corporate jets" which he stated, what, 10 times the last week? Also attacking "big business" "big oil" is going to make them suddenly feel they should pay more when they are the top 1% paying in, he is sadly mistaken. Every person on this board doesn't like paying in taxes. Not one of us. If there is some on here that like doing it, do you overpay to give to the poor? No, you give to charity which will do a better job than the Fed helping the poor. I remember BHO claiming to becoming president and stopping the divide of the country. Ha, ya, that isn't going to happen for any President. So funny how people latched onto that one.

So how does it become ok to tax rich more and more? If I had that kind of money I'd flip off the Fed and shift it overseas, which most do now anyway to avoid getting pinched more money for more government regulation. I seriously don't understand how the Feds will do better at anything than the private sector could do. It is just to large now, to bloated .

Sorry to get off on a rant, it has been a long day. 110 in the shop then out in the sun for Football practice for the kid. The cold beer kicked in and my mind just starting going.

As for Blackout's post. Don't discredit it, there is a reason Ammunition sales, gun sales, training classes all have risen in sales and profit. There is a belief that this "Haves vs. Have Not's" could escalate. For me personally I doubt the level will get to a country wide Marshall law but I have seen in my area a increase in crimes that aren't as usual as before. So preparing and protecting during extremely rough times like right now are not as crazy as they sounded say, 2003, when things were booming along.

Hell, anyone who knows me enough knows I have a small arsenal and carry, legally. I can't wait for Concealed Carry to go into affect Nov. 1st.

Edit, I bring this all down to a personal level because I am a Libertarian. For the most part I'll live my life as I want and generally agree with things from both the left or right, but find extremely big flaws with the left and right to not get on board with them in a serious fashion.

I understood approximately 3 words in the last 2 pages